Russian negotiation tactics are a funny thing. It’s been well documented that their truculence in negotations is as follows:
**Maximalist Goals! **- Concessions are for the loser. Concern for Life, Justice and Diplomacy are tools of the weak to keep down the strong. Demand everything, concede nothing, and eventually the other side will, out of their soft decadence, give you something to make it all stop. And then you have something you didn’t have before!
Well - take a few steps back. War is politics by other means - a political objective is sought by force. In this case, Russia obviously WANTED regime change and territorial conquest. They aren’t going to get either in this phase of their 1,000 year enslavement project, and they do know it.
So what does it all mean? Why is their official position, like in the article, "WE WILL NOT NEOGITATE!! THE WEST REFUSES TO ADDRESS THE CORE ISSUES BLAH BLAH BLAH BLYAT!. <Free Shrugs>. But break it down a bit:
- Russia can’t advance anymore in any meaningful way. Their dual tactics of forcing men into holes and waiting to be killed + standoff terror attacks cannot possibly achieve their objectives.
- Their leaders are not budging one inch, as they expect to be given something that rationalizes their idiotic invasion’s massive losses. They should stop. They should’ve stopped a long time again. They can’t stop now, as they’ll be the ones making concessions. Concessions that probably roll them at LEAST back to 2022 boundaries, and maybe even 2014. 1991 seems unrealistic in the short term - there’s no way to make them leave Donetsk or Luhansk easily. But - that’s not necessary for Ukraine to Win. You can probably make them leave Crimea without the bloody business of kicking them out forcefully. That’s what’s happening right now. Crimea is being made untenable. Donetsk & Luhansk would have to come later, and by other means. If at all - there might be a realpolitik basis to just let portions go anyways as a buffer zone for lots of reasons.
- They still act like they expect that the U.S. or EU will force Ukraine to make concessions. And in normal times, that might be viable. But their agent Trump is such a complete tool that Ukraine survives without direct US aid. He’s alientated ALL of their traditional allies, and has pissed away any leverage they had about what MIGHT happen if the U.S. pulled suport. He just went ahead and did it - because he’s an idiot - and guess what? The 2025 version of the Ukrainian army can continue to resist the 2025 version of the Russian one. Short of the U.S. invading Ukraine, they can’t do anything else. Certainly the Iranian experience showed the limits of american air strikes when you’re not willing to risk casualities in a ground war.
- And Europe - which views the threat of a Russia rewarded for invasion very differently than the current American administration does - is willing to quietly and slowly defy impotent U.S. demands that Ukraine make permanent concessions.
Ukraine is now bombing even Moscow, nearly at will. The Russian population, so long complacent and feeling unaffected by the war beign fought in their name, is now feeling real pain. Nothing like what they have subjected Ukrainians to - but for them, real, undeniable pain and a confused anxiety as to why their Stronk Invincible Inevitable army can’t protect them. Not just inflation, or sanctions, or gas prices. Huge explosions inside the Moscow city limits, while their Air Defense continues to show it’s complete ineffectiveness.
WTF is Russia’s political leadership doing? I dunno - but at some level, they are DEFINITELY stalling for time. Time for what? Who knows. Every day that goes by, their negotiating position gets worse and worse. Their small squad infiltration tactics & terror bombing is ineffective as a war winning strategy, and Ukraine can probably continue at this pace for a long, long time. Can the Russians? We’ll see.
Diplomatically, and Militarily - the Russians seem stuck in the 20th century. Their Horde War philosophy STILL depends on rational actors on the West side who don’t have much appetite for conflict because they’re afraid of what the Russians might do. But - their bluff was called - and they’re a joke, frankly. It turns out that what they CAN do is not that much. This chest-thumping assumption that they could roll from Poland to Portugal before anyone could do anything has proven to be a complete myth. They wish for peace-loving/feckless pussies in NATO to force Ukraine to concede, as would be more likely under Cold War rules where the threat of nuclear escalation trumped all. But that’s also dead in the water, because the world realizes there’s not really any basis for a nuclear war to happen when you’re failing to win a war against your neighbour and the presumed enemy America is led by your best intelligence asset. They can’t admit defeat to an inferior race like the Ukrainians. Hubris is a prison.
So what are the heck are they doing? Losing. Stalling for time. Preparing their bolt holes in case of a political collapse. Why aren’t they talking seriously about realistic negotiations when their capital is being attacked daily? They can’t win. They have already lost. But as optimistic as that sounds, this means their leadership is not acting rationally - this war will continue as long as Putin is alive or the army collapses completely.
Russian FM & Part Time Ghoul Lavrov Rejects Western Demands for Peace Plan
So you have chosen death then
While I agree with your summary, I think the answer as to why they can’t end the war is obvious.
They need the war to stay in power now and by extension to stay alive. The second it stops and it’s not a huge victory they will be over thrown and will be dead shortly thereafter.
They have no qualms with sacrificing every Russian to stay in power.
Personally I think the other insane option they may pursue is to somehow provoke the West into an armed conflict so they can “loose” to a greater power rather than to Ukraine alone. They might be able to justify the losses if it was to an Evil Western alliance. Hence the escalations with Europe recently.
Thanks for the input. RE: Needing the war…yeah, I get it, but I’m not sure that there is a certainty that as soon as it stops, he will be liquidated. You need a faction to take over a country - organized, reasonably committed to a concept, different skills at different levels in a hierarchy. Maybe some thing they have a core of people they can trust - but this is Russia, and despite their butcherous incompetence and malignant greed - what they HAVE been good at is smashing any tiny ember of organized opposition.
I think they DO have qualms about sacrificing every Russian, as they are really just gangsters who want to lead tacky lives skimming off money from economic activity. You can’t steal what no longer exists. But - I think they also are in a trap of having weak institutions outside of the intelligence services and nobody really knows WHAT to do, never mind if they have the organizational effectiveness to do it.
The “losing to a worthy adversary” thing - yeah, that hubris is definitely part of their self image, but when you consider yourself a Great Super Power (even though you’re not, and on some level, the bright ones there probably understnad it), then the only one you’re allowed to lose to is the U.S. But it’s broadly accepted that Trump is their puppet, so…how can you surrender to your subordinate who, in NO WAY, could you reasonably construct a story that you are activey fighting.
This is kind of the weird paradox of having an idiot like Trump for an asset. He always pretends he has more leverage than he actually does. First year, FIRST big thing he did was cut direct U.S. support and tried to strong arm Ukraine into taking a bad deal. Europe stepped into the funding breach, and the 2025 version of the Ukrainian army turns out to be fully capable of resisting the 2025 version of the Russian army, even without direct U.S. military aid. In short - the fear of what WOULD happen if the U.S. pulled aid was more useful than the reality. Turns out, the U.S. aid isn’t that important to the current state of the war. And thus Ukraine doesn’t have to fear what the U.S. MIGHT do, because they’ve already done all they can, short of joining the war on the side of the Russians.
So - the SECOND big thing Trump did was start threatending allies like Denmark and Canada with invasion, and shooting ridiculous tarriffs in every direction. Degrade NATO, and erode economics. In a sense - if you can’t MAKE Europe stop supporting Ukraine, then cause a global recession to try and force them to be more selfish about their economies indirectly, forcing them to cut Ukrainian aid. That didn’t work, because it turns out crashing the global economy isn’t good for the U.S. economy either. And his mouthbreathing MAGAt horde doesn’t have investor-class levels of cash reserves to ride out a multi year recession. Probably behind closed doors, the EU told Trump’s team that if they so much as landed a pleasure craft in Greenland with a soldier on it, they would dump all U.S. Treasury reserves instantly and destroy the american economy, along with their own.
Then the THIRD big thing he did was starting to get invade-y by punching down on Venezuela, and he thought he could do the same to Iran. Again, he pissed away any military credibility they earned in Venezuela by being Netanyahu’s water-carrier in the ridiculous attack on Iran. The U.S. military’s limits are now clear - they are not interested in a boots-on-the-ground quagmire bloodbath. Well - Iran is not Venezuela and the limits of air strikes have been broadcast loud and clear. It’s hard to see Trump getting broad approval for another military boogaloo even in, say Cuba, much less literally attacking your allies.
Getting off on a tangent here, but - the point is - No serious minded thinkers in Russia think they’re fighting the U.S. right now. They’re not even talking about it in their most spittle-froth spewing propaganda channels. So - who are you ALLOWED to lose to? Britain? France? Germany? The Poles? That puts them in a pretty tight spot where they are only allowed to lose to a country whose leader is an obedident slave of your own.
So what CAN they do to trigger a russia-friendly outcome I mean? I don’t think they CAN do much anymore. They had options a couple of years ago and they had momentum. They were idiotic and greedy and doubled-down…because…reasons…and now Crimea is on the verge of being under seige. No water, no fuel, and soon no food or air defense. If Crimea collapses, then things will get very, very, very, very, very, very bad for them. As it is - their capitol is being bombed, their effective air defense is collapsing, they haven’t gained any meaningful ground in nearly two years, the economy is teetering on implosion, people are feeling the effects of the war in the few big cities that actually matter. Ukraine is getting stronger and Russia is getting into unthinkable, untenable situations. I dunno - all that to say, I think the game is later than people realize, and that there’s going to be some major major changes, soon.
Thanks for the chin wag.
Part time ghoul?
Naah… Lavrov’s a full time employee now.
Tie this with the fact that the Russian defense forces have their press gangs out in full force now, apparently sweeping up any Russian with a dick that’s got short curlies around it, and the picture is one of an increasingly desperate situation.
Fuck these old, impotent males and their fragile egos. Fuck ALL of them, not just the Russian ones, no… every last one, straight to hell.
You’re not supposed to alter the headlines of the URL. I did so as little as possible.
Yeah. It looks grim and unlikely to get better. So why not even PRETEND to negotiate? Maybe the simple answer is - they’re never going to. This ends the way of Gaddhafi, Mussolini, Ceaucescu and Hitler did. Their capitol is being bombed, their economy is teetering on collapse, their army is achieving nothing, people can’t afford to drive. The time to have an orderly exit was 6-12 months ago, or more. Since it’s now to this point, the odds of there being a peaceful end with a stable Russian state are falling rapidly.
Honestly - that’s frightening in a different way. Hopefully some people close to Putin agree. The russian tradition, from Nicholas to Stalin to Chernobyl has been to pin all blame for a disaster a scapegoat and then try and pretend it didn’t happen after they’re dead. It seem pretty likely that tradition will continue.
I understand it is cathartic to editorialize the Title and agree with the sentiment. I’m also under no illusion that this forum has a strong pro-Ukrainian bias. That said, it is convention not to editorialize titles for good reason. Mainly, that it emphasizes the bias within this forum and casts a shadow over the accuracy of the information being provided here.
No rule was broken, and I’d prefer to not go through the hassle of outright declaring it a rule. I simply ask that the community try to resist the urge to editorialize in the future. For the good of this community and Ukraine in general.
Thank you for attending this TED talk.
My apologies for putting you in this position as an admin, it was a concious and playful minor addition, with no attempt to mislead anyone as to the content of the article. I don’t think the lazy and juvenile characterization of him as a ghoul would change the context. But rules are rules, and I will comply going forward.
They can’t retreat cause empires don’t tolerate weakness. Thats why there were so many attempts “to preserve russians face” at negotiations, all of that denied by Ukraine (rightfully).
The best they can expect is current lines, and no recognition of occupied lands. And that means “betraying people of Donbass” (not like that ever mattered, but we are dealing with symbols).
All that, and you also would need to shift from wartime economy to civilian while still sanctioned.
Imo, they would try full-scale mobilisation and zerg rush first.
They had lots of chances where the smart thing would have been to stop over the past few years. At this point, they’re spent - on many levels - and any serous minded person can see it. Hubris is a prison
I don’t think they can do a big mobilization, and here’s why. First - politically and economically. They have already used up the most worthless mouths they could exchange for good ukrainian land. Mobilization now will cut deeper into the socioeconomic classes that they actually NEED going forward. Which will come with increased blowback internally. The other reason I don’t think they can is timing. If you needed reinforcements today, then you needed to get them into the pipeline 6m ago. They didn’t do it, and they’ve let their 2026 campaign sputter and Ukraine regain the initiative, which itself makes future mobilization more difficult if the brighter, more informed meat you’re dressing up this time is less convinced of the certainy of success. Or survival.
What would full-scale produce? 300k more bodies, in about 6-12 months, at great internal cost? That would be about half a year’s worth of casualties marching into seasoned Ukraininan drone swarm kill zones. They don’t have the mechanized armor or air support for an effective zerg rush anymore. Just replacing raw numbers isn’t the same as maintaining or improving the quality of your Average Figthing Man. Russian capabilities are declining, and it’s not a slow incremental slide - it’s a friggin’ matterhorn drop in effective capability once you’ve lost your professional army AND your soviet hardware inheritance.
Thanks for the chin wag.
6 months is assuming you gonna give them any decent training. Their main propaganda theme for many years was ww2 and to be like their grandfathers in it.
So yeah, they’ve progressed in their ww2 cosplay but we can go deeper. They still have personal rifles, after all, and not just several per 30 men.
As for the bit about taking people who are actually needed - well “victory, we wouldn’t stand behind the price”, same ww2 narrative.
Now, there is a risk full scale mobilisation would trigger some uncontrollable processes. And they were evading it for quite some time.
But the thing is, I don’t think russian leadership is purely rational. Their leader sees himself as a messiah on a holy mission to reunite the Rus and be the Gatherer of Russian Lands.
I don’t think he will bail and I’m fine with it. We need to end russia now, not to leave this problem to our children.
6 months is assuming you gonna give them any decent training. Their main propaganda theme for many years was ww2 and to be like their grandfathers in it.
So yeah, they’ve progressed in their ww2 cosplay but we can go deeper. They still have personal rifles, after all, and not just several per 30 men.
As for the bit about taking people who are actually needed - well “victory, we wouldn’t stand behind the price”, same ww2 narrative.
Now, there is a risk full scale mobilisation would trigger some uncontrollable processes. And they were evading it for quite some time.
But the thing is, I don’t think russian leadership is purely rational. Their leader sees himself as a messiah on a holy mission to reunite the Rus and be the Gatherer of Russian Lands.
I don’t think he will bail and I’m fine with it. We need to end russia now, not to leave this problem to our children.
I’m not sure how useful comparisons to WW2 are, though they are clearly used to appeal to mythical nonsense for propaganda purposes. Suggesting that WW2 still has lessons to learn 80 years after the fact is like being in WW2 and saying that you should heed the lessons of the Franco-Prussian War of 1870. The battles and military capabilities are in absolutely different universes.
As for the “mission”. Yeah, maybe. That might also be guilding the lily a bit. These are (quite often literally) gangsters ingratiated with the malign power of the Russian intelligence and security services. Platitudes about glory and restoring the entitled imperial greatness of russia is perhaps again propaganda draped over the more pragmatic goal of slimy gangsters getting a little bit richer, while feeding lies to the masses to keep them compliant. Are Putin and his immediate enablers rational? Well - sort of yes, but as you say sort of no, or they would have stopped by now and been content with having shown the world they are serious about their near-abroad security. I absolutely agree with you that he won’t bail now - the time has passed for an orderly, principled conclusion. He’s chosen the more violent personal exit route of mussolini, Gaddhafi and Caeucescu. How and when we get there is all that’s left to be decided.
Thank you for your input!
OP, while I don’t disagree with the sentiment, I think it’s a better call to leave the title unadulterated , and editorialize (if you wish) in the post description.
You’re right, of course. It’s 3 words, and says more about my immaturity than it does any damage to the context of the article. But you’re still right.
Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov Rejects Western Demands for Peace Plan
The actual title. I don’t understand why you would change that.
it’s 3 words, because I’m still immature even at advanced age, and no attempt to mislead anyone on the context of the article. But rules are rules.
… The “leadership” in Russia is so incompetent and malevolent they might just launch nukes out of spite. They’ll hide away in their bunkers in siberia and tell each other, “if we can’t have the world, then no one can.” If Hitler could’ve caused the entire eastern seaboard of the United States to spontaneously melt into radioactive glass at the push of a button, you must realize that he would push it right before shooting himself.
Hope not, and I doubt it. China is Russia’s boss now, and they won’t allow that. China are traders first, warriors second. Nuking Ukraine doesn’t have any upside for China.
Besides - who would you actually nuke? You’re invading Ukraine to control it - these are intelligence service gangsters running the country, and they love their tacky ass lives of dachas, supercars, trips abroad, yachts, caviar, champagne, mistressses and murder. This war was always about slimy, overpromoted, black hearted gangster ghouls trying to win glory and get a little bit richer. And solving Russia’s terminal demographic decline. When you claim your neighbour’s land is actually yours, turning it into a glowing ashtray doesn’t make any sense.
Even if you accepted that and it was pure spite and revenge - IT’S RIGHT NEXT DOOR. And that would be the end of Russia as member of the global community. They’d become an agrarian wasteland cut off from ALL trade, unable buy or sell to anyone who remotely has the things they have to have to sustain an industrial society that already doesn’t sustain it’s own needs.
Nuke the US? When their leader works for you? Not happening. Nuke Europe? Russian air defense can’t handle Ukrainian drones today You think they can stop British and French missile launched nukes? Germany would have nukes in about a month, followed by Poland, Italy, Spain, Canada, Australia etc
No matter what - the Russians may be acting like idiots, but they probably still want to live. Probably. Nukes aren’t a reset button for past mistakes.
the problem with relying on “mutually assured destruction” is that it requires presupposing rational actors on all sides. But when an oligarch starts to accept that their adventurous life of debauchery, decadence, violence, and obscenity in all three realms is no longer going to continue, i don’t think they even CARE about how anyone else feels or whatever happens after they’re gone.
so, yeah, i think they WOULD in fact nuke europe. Possibly even chuck 'em at every NATO nation because they keep beating the dead horse of claiming that ukraine is being puppeted by NATO.
It would be nice if it turned out that whoever is sitting in the missile silo command centers has better morals than the scum fleshwastes who are in charge, evading armageddon via conscientious objection AGAIN just like that one time a radar malfunction over the northern arctic almost caused russia to preemptive strike the united states back during the cold war but for ONE DUDE who decided he wouldn’t make the call that could end the world.
it’s lowkey akin to a narcissist’s ‘extinction burst’. they’re losing everything so they blow up and burn it all, shrieking incoherently from their quivering ball of white hot impotent rage “YoU mAdE mE dO tHiS!1!!!11one!1!1!1”
EDIT:
BUT FOR REAL, ALL THAT SAID, I don’t even really disagree with you THAT much. Because if it IS a rational actor, they probably WOULD decide as you predict…
… IF a rational actor x.x
, yeah, i think they WOULD in fact nuke europe. Possibly even chuck 'em at every NATO nation because they keep beating the dead horse of claiming that ukraine is being puppeted by NATO.
It would be nice if it turned out that whoever is sitting in the missile silo command centers has better morals than the scum fleshwastes who are in charge, evading armageddon via conscientious objection AGAIN just like that one time a radar malfunction over the northern arctic almost caused russia to preemptive strike the united states back during the cold war but for ONE DUDE who decided he wouldn’t make the call that could end the world.
it’s lowkey akin to a narcissist’s ‘extinction burst’. they’re losing everything so they blow up and burn it all, shrieking incoherently from their quivering ball of white hot impotent rage “YoU mAdE mE dO tHiS!1!!!11one!1!1!1”
He’s rational enough to be researching organ transplants and seeking eternal life. That’s insane and abomination, but it at least implies he’s enjoying this life well enough to want to preserve it. And the people who would have to execute an order from a dying Putin to nuke the world have to live in it after he’s dead, and they’ve got loved ones and lives that they would probably like to continue. China, and others inside the gangster family that runs the FSB are unlikely to trigger themselves into being incinerated because Putin doesn’t accept mortality. The FSB rather likes what they have in Russia, and are even trying to expand it.






