Thousands of purveyors of neo-Nazi tunes just had their day ruined by a crew of enterprising Scandinavian anti-fascists.

  • aseriesoftubes@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I love that some of these idiots used their work email addresses. I wonder if Full Care landscaping out of Louisville, Kentucky cares that their VP of Operations is a neo-nazi?

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    I’ve blocked all the nazis trying to engage with me saying nazis aren’t bad so I’ll just say this in a TLC and block more nazis when they reply -

    It’s funny that all the people calling ME evil for not considering the nuances of various people’s nazi ideology… Are the same people who think women should die for wearing jeans, and that people should die for having a different religion, or die for not sharing a skin tone…

    Nazis are nazis are nazis. If your world view was so different, spoilers, you wouldn’t identify with nazis. 🤷

    FUCK NAZIS.

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      There are people siding with Nazis and reporting this post for doxxing, lol

    • Lianodel@ttrpg.network
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      Also, just to see if they have even the tiniest bit of plausible deniability, I checked out Midgard’s shop. There’s overtly white supremacist shit ALL OVER the place.

      It’s not like these people accidentally supported a band with reprehensible beliefs behind the scenes. It’s not like a totally normal music shop turned out to be a front for white supremacists. There’s note even any serious argument about “separating art from the artist.” The leak includes what people bought, and you can tell when someone bought overtly white supremacist music. And even if they didn’t, and the band or album name doesn’t give anything away, what’s it doing at the Nazi store? Why isn’t it streaming, or on Bandcamp, or self-distributed? These customers still had to know there’s an obscure Nazis music store, what it’s called and where to find it, confirm that it’s a Nazi store the moment they went there, and still give them money and their address to place a mail order. Oh, some of them aren’t native English speakers? Then that just makes it even more damning that they did all this with a language barrier in place!

      Plus, just look at the apologists in this thread. They’re fucking cowards. They can’t just come out with their beliefs, so they’re just asking questions, deflecting from the topic. One is concern trolling for the fundamental humanity of literal Nazis, despite the fact that the main fucking problem with Nazis is that they considered marginalized groups subhuman. Where’s the concern there? Why the focus on the people who oppose Nazis rather than the Nazis themselves? Another one could barely resist giving the game away by saying they’ve been called a Nazi before because of their anti-immigrant positions.

      The people defending this shop and its customers aren’t serious people. They’re dishonest, cowardly, and stupid.

    • some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org
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      Check Talia Levin’s book, Culture Warlords. She spent a year undercover online as a far-right personality and wrote about the encounters she experienced. It was a rough time, clearly. She’s in the punch-a-nazi camp and reading her book landed me there at the end.

    • vxx@lemmy.world
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      I would advise to call them Neo-Nazis instead of Nazis. Most Nazis are dead and Neo-Nazis are given too much distraction by giving them this easy excuse.

      • Aniki 🌱🌿@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        That’s such a stupid fucking argument to nit pick it’s almost absurd.

        Nazis is as Nazis does. Adding a prefix changes nothing.

    • rab@lemmy.ca
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      You remind me of one of my friends who uses the word nazi so much it’s basically lost all its weight

      • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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        Imagine getting mad at someone saying Nazis are bad. I wouldn’t be caught dead getting upset that someone was saying Nazis are bad, lmao

        • rab@lemmy.ca
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          What annoys me is throwing the word around like it’s nothing, dude calls pretty much anyone a nazi lol

          For example, I was called a nazi for saying maybe Canada is taking too many immigrants at once

          • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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            Depends entirely on the context. Framed like that? Probably not a Nazi, but I wouldn’t dare make judgement without knowing what actually transpired.

            Might be a hot take, but the idea that the word “Nazi” is thrown around like it’s nothing is actually overblown, and usually it’s correctly thrown.

            • rab@lemmy.ca
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              Maybe my friends are dumb but the far left ones love using the word whenever possible

              • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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                Usually the far left calls everyone a liberal, it’s liberals that call conservatives Nazis. The far left usually calls actual fascists Nazis.

                • rab@lemmy.ca
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                  Yeah I’m economically far left but socially I lean a little further right, which has gotten me called a nazi before, which is ridiculous if you actually know me haha

      • Facebones@reddthat.com
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        You remind me of apologists who argue somebody can’t be a nazi even though they spout the ideology and use the language, because they aren’t on record saying “I heart Hitler” three times in a mirror.

        • rab@lemmy.ca
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          I dunno someone called me a nazi recently at my university for wearing a burzum shirt for example lol

          Word is definitely getting thrown around a lot these days

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            It’s not coincidence, there’s alot more nazis running around on some nazi shit. By the way in case you didn’t know, while I don’t recall it coming up in the music (I have a Burzum CD around here somewhere) but - Burzum/Varg was increasingly on some nazi/white nationalist shit, so it’s not some “fuckin LiBrUlZ” conspiracy to call everybody a nazi, you were just wearing a shirt associated with nazi shit. 🤷

            • rab@lemmy.ca
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              I know who varg is. It’s impossible to listen to black metal and entirely avoid this kind of thing. I was wearing a hvis lyset tar oss shirt, there are no such themes on the album, and I bought the shirt way before varg went full nazi on YouTube (it’s counterfeit anyway so he got nothing from me)

              The only black metal I avoid are ones where nazi themes are explicitly in the lyrics

              Do digging on the people behind any black metal band and you’ll probably find something similar, it’s extreme music made by extreme people

              • Facebones@reddthat.com
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                You’re missing the point - you weren’t called a nazi cause you were wearing a sccarryy black metal tee. You were called a nazi for wearing a nazi’s tee.

                Whatevs, you’ve made it abundantly clear that you’re being intentionally obtuse in defense of nazis so I’m over it. Bye Felicia.

    • mob@lemmy.world
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      Nazis are obviously bad, but this comment makes me think that anyone you don’t like/like their comments/replies, you consider a Nazi?

      • Facebones@reddthat.com
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        I think people who defend nazis, their right to believe in nazi ideology, and argue that nazis are overall fine people are nazis or nazi apologists which are equally unwelcome in my circles and consciousness. Sorry, I’m not going to feel bad for hurting nazi feelings.

        You can reply to this and “um actually” all you want about nazis, but if you’re pro-nazi, I’m gonna block you. Easy peasy.

        • brbposting@sh.itjust.works
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          Gotta do my part and never block anybody so I can advocate for e.g. defederating nazinstances.

          It ain’t much, but…

            • mob@lemmy.world
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              I’m confused by the whole comment line. Do I seem like I’m outraging, or have any strong opinions any way that needs to be clarified?

                • mob@lemmy.world
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                  It’s an irrelevant question leading into a off topic point that you’d like to make. If you’d like to deliver a point, go ahead and comment it. Not my job to try and land your point for you though.

        • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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          Per Capita, in total, Per capita per year, or total per year? Each of these 4 types has a different answer, and the Nazis were higher in nearly every metric of slaughter.

          The US is bad. The US has never been fully fascist, despite flirting with it. Nazi Germany was perhaps the most evil and oppressive country to ever exist in history, and certainly was for the 20th century.

          What exactly is your point? Nazis are bad, but so is the US? I don’t think too many people on Lemmy are fans of the US, but to insinuate that the Nazis are somehow more palatable by being compared to the US is absurd.

          • mob@lemmy.world
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            Even without defining those parameters, I also thought it was sort of strange to compare a political party vs country.

            • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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              It’s all strange. What’s the point? “Hmmm, you think Nazis are bad? Have you considered that other countries are bad but significantly less bad? Checkmate!” It’s just terminally online.

              • mob@lemmy.world
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                Oh yeah, at it’s root, it was already bad.

                I’m always interested in a decent discussion or thought experiment though, even if I completely disagree with the other person. 99% are so lazy nowadays it’s not even interesting reading their copy/paste comments that have been recycled for the last decade

          • cameron_vale@lemm.ee
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            Ooh, evasive. Which metric did USA win? And by how much?

            Just delivering a dose of sanity to this low hanging fruit salad.

            Of course nazis are bad. But you people. Look at you. Frothing on command. Bunch of drones waiting for your target programming.

            • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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              Odd to call it “winning,” but the answer is “historical total.” The US has murdered tens of millions more over its several hundred year history than Nazi Germany killed in the less than half a century it existed.

              It isn’t sanity to pretend that hundreds of years of brutal history are equally comparable to an extremely condensed period of the single most brutal country to exist in modern history. Nazism is far more evil than liberalism, even if liberalism is still inevitably evil.

              • cameron_vale@lemm.ee
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                Oh how you evade my point.

                Remember. A few years of deprivation, a rousing propaganda campaign and a billionaire’s funding, and you too might become the next “bad guy”.

                Heck, none of these people ever saw a nazi outside of a videogame, and look at their passion. Puppets looking for a master.

            • CileTheSane@lemmy.ca
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              Ooh, evasive. Which metric did USA win? And by how much?

              If you knew anything about what you were talking about you would already know.

            • YeetPics@mander.xyz
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              Nazis love dehumanizing people

              Bunch of drones

              Go on and tell us how much better you are than a Nazi.

                • YeetPics@mander.xyz
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                  Nazi is a subclassification of humans, it actually does the opposite of dehumanizing by more thoroughly defining the human/humanity relationship.

                  But if me saying “fuck Nazis” gets you riled up so be it 🫡

        • YeetPics@mander.xyz
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          If the bar for being a Nazi is merely killing people many of us would be Nazis. Personally I think nazihood has more to do with a wish to genocide (the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group.).

          • cameron_vale@lemm.ee
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            Normal people just want to pay their bills and get high. But sometimes life gets fucked up and people are stressed out.

            Then some politicians come along with a story about how those guys with the different skin/religion/etc are to blame.

            And then some rich guys buy you some guns.

            So maybe it’s the politicians and the rich guys that we should be looking at.

            • YeetPics@mander.xyz
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              So maybe it’s the politicians and the rich guys that we should be looking at.

              You don’t need money or power to be a deadbeat fucking Nazi.

  • dylanmorgan@slrpnk.net
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    Man, far right websites all seem to have shit infosec as a common thread along with racism and other assorted bigotry.

    • Mateoto@lemmy.world
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      Scary. The one I found from my city is a medical doctor with a good reputation. Fucking Nazis hiding good.

      • jopepa@lemmy.world
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        The one from my home town wound up in prison for 4th degree arson. Burned down his own house by accident.

        • Deceptichum@kbin.social
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          Second guy I’m looking up has already been doxed by some racist-metal site bitching that he was selling pirated copies of their CDs on eBay.

          • jopepa@lemmy.world
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            Good to remember the enemy of your enemy isn’t always your friend. Sometimes it’s best to sit back and enjoy their self destructive little happenings

    • Rodeo@lemmy.ca
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      What are the legal implications of doxxing a person here? I can think of a few people I’d like to slap on that list, but it doesn’t seem risk free for me.

      • jopepa@lemmy.world
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        Fucking with nazis is never risk free, but not fucking with them is much riskier

      • jopepa@lemmy.world
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        Congratulations! This is only a directory of nazi punks and edgelord book clubs, really. Don’t get complacent, vote.

          • jopepa@lemmy.world
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            Nazis and white supremacists get a footing in government because they organize and vote. If the general population gets complacent and doesn’t vote then nazis poof into seats of power and influence. So what are you trying to say here?

    • RealFknNito@lemmy.world
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      I don’t know what Neo-Nazi music is but if the music is good some of these could just be people listening to music.

      • PoliticalAgitator@lemm.ee
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        Music is an extremely important part of my life but there isn’t a single band that would make me give money to neo-nazis.

        I don’t know why everyone is so eager to absolve them. If they have something to say in their defense, they can say it themselves.

        • RecallMadness@lemmy.nz
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          I like folk music and industrial music. The overlap of the two seems to also have a disproportionate overlap of … what’s the best way to put it?… fascist-adjacent music. Imagery, themes, etc.

          Am I a fascist? No.

          Are the artists fascist? I don’t know, Boyd Rice sure has had some controversies about him, but he’s not been banned from streaming services. But In some ways I don’t care, I don’t have the time to unpick every lyric, image and interview from the artists I listen to, to make a decision on their political views. I just like the music. Open a public playlist and listen.

          None of the music I listen to appears to be sold on Midgard. But does that mean they’re not fascist?

          • PoliticalAgitator@lemm.ee
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            You don’t need to be a fascist to make excuses for fascists, but it’s bizarre that you read my comment about all the apologists the decided “he just hasn’t heard my brilliant apologise yet”.

            You can drop the “it could happen to you” act because it almost certainly won’t. For this site and those albums, “I just didn’t have time to unpick what the lyric ‘until every kike is dead’ meant” isn’t even a remotely plausible excuse.

            Stop defending them.

        • RealFknNito@lemmy.world
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          Because Neo-Nazis listening to Neo-Nazi music isn’t the same as people listening to Neo-Nazi music. I’ve listened to songs with suicidal lyrics, I’m not suicidal. I’ve listened to songs about heartbreak, I’m not really that torn up about my relationship right now.

          I’m not trying to absolve them I’m trying to shake some sense into the people on an emotional crusade that are supporting doxxing because it’s against people they don’t like. It’s getting exhausting seeing people become increasingly unhinged and justifying it because “well, they’re baddies.”

          • Mongostein@lemmy.ca
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            No. There’s no plausible deniability here. These bands’ whole gimmick is that they’re Nazis. It’s not some catchy tune you randomly heard on the radio. There is nothing subtle about it. It’s racist songs with racist lyrics. You would have to seek it out to listen to this garbage.

            • RealFknNito@lemmy.world
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              Again, a lot of the people listed here are from Japan. I don’t know the lyrics to a lot of Japanese songs but you’re saying everyone from Japan who listens to these are neo-nazis? As in white supremacists? Make this make sense boss.

              • Mongostein@lemmy.ca
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                Well I don’t live in Japan so I’m not worried about that. Also, tons of Japanese people speak English.

                • Lianodel@ttrpg.network
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                  Also, can we appreciate how desperate and nonsensical that entire argument was?

                  Okay, lots of them are Japanese. So… what about the ones that aren’t? Why isn’t that person concerned about the one who absolutely understand what it means?

                  And secondly… it’s still a huge red flag that Japanese customers were going so far out of their way to buy extremely obscure music from racist bands from an overtly Nazi music seller. If an American specifically imported music from a Japanese shop only racists know or care about, covered in Axis power imagery, that’d still point towards being a huge racist.

                  That user is seriously turning themselves in knots to defend people who buy Nazi music from the Nazi store.

                • RealFknNito@lemmy.world
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                  Okay but… follow the logic thread you’re weaving.

                  If only neo-nazis listen to neo-nazi music, what is the likilhood that there are bilingual neo-nazi’s living in Japan?

                  I’d reckon it’s not very high meaning there are probably innocent people who had their shit leaked for no good reason.

              • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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                This might surprise you, but Japan has very close ties with fascism. Ever seen the Japanese flag with the rays coming from the center red sun? That’s the flag of Imperial Japan, a fascist terror that scarred much of Asia. Japan refuses to denounce their war crimes, and there are an unfortunate number of reactionary fascists who use the flag of Imperial Japan as a symbol they support.

                I’m absolutely not saying that every Japanese person is a fascist, not even close. I am, however, saying that I’m fairly confident that these particular Japanese fans are aware of the Nazi ideology of the bands they listen to, and listen precisely because of that.

          • PoliticalAgitator@lemm.ee
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            I’ve listened to songs with suicidal lyrics, I’m not suicidal

            A song with “suicidal lyrics” is not even remotely comparable to the albums this site sells, which is why they don’t need a dedicated pro-suicide website to sell them on.

            Would you rush to defend an album put out by ISIS, that pushed the agenda of ISIS, with all profits going to ISIS?

            It’s getting exhausting seeing people become increasingly unhinged and justifying it because “well, they’re baddies.”

            Then maybe you should explain your exhaustion to the group responsible for their overwhelming majority of mass shootings, who openly celebrate the killing of black and LGBT+ people, rather than someone you’ve decided isn’t appropriately sad that neo-nazis got exposed for doing a thing they did.

      • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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        I certainly wouldn’t listen to Neo-Nazi music no matter how nice the tunes are, because I personally couldn’t stand supporting literal fucking Nazis and listening to Nazi bullshit.

        It’s not like the Nazis are the only ones making music, there are countless good, leftist bands out there. There aren’t slim pickings, there are oceans of good music out there.

        • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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          Benefit of the doubt is a huge deal. It’s entirely possible to enjoy music and have NO idea of the message, themes, content, etc. source: Pumped Up Kicks.

          Edit to add: Iced Earth. Really fun power metal band. Loved a ton of their stuff, and then found out the bands lead was arrested at the jan. 6 riot. That stuff doesn’t really bleed into their music, and I was avoiding them for a while because of it, but at the end of the day, the music is good, and that’s why we listen to music.

          • Cowbee@lemm.ee
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            Pumped Up Kicks is explicit satire, not an actual call for school shootings.

            Let me ask this: what makes more sense, a random, specifically Japanese group of people, enjoys northern European Neo-Nazi music for the tunes? Or, perhaps, the fact that Japan has legitimate fascist movements, and historical ties to fascism without heavily denouncing them like Germany, means fascists are likely to search out more fascist music?

            I understand your point, but it’s incredibly hard to just randomly stumble upon fascist music and enjoy it for the vibes. This is a specific level of dedication in a country with higher than normal levels of support for fascism.

        • Infiltrated_ad8271@kbin.social
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          The paradox of tolerance is about absolute/unlimited tolerance. One can set limits on tolerance and respect the human rights of the intolerant, it’s not mutually exclusive.

          Btw, the combination of “X people don’t deserve human rights” and “those who don’t support taking rights away from X are equal to X” is especially atrocious.

        • Melllvar@startrek.website
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          There’s no paradox if you look at it as a social contract. If you don’t uphold your part of the contract (tolerating others) then you aren’t entitled to benefits from the contract (being tolerated by others).

        • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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          The tolerance paradox is bullshit. Source: Daryl Davis, the black dude who converted a ton (like over 80) KKK members by just being a tolerant human to them.

          You have to tolerate the person, not the message. You can say “you’re a valid human being” and “the stuff that comes out of your mouth is actually terrible” at the same time. Doing anything else pushes all of those valid humans with bad ideas together and makes a big echo chamber.

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            1 year ago

            He didn’t say we should just say gas them to death (like they’d do to some of us in a heartbeat), he just pointed out they deserve no right to be aggressive against minorities.

            I see no issue there. If they want to be decent citizens there’s an easy solution to that; stop being a nazi.

            Edit: I otherwise agree with your comment, as they probably need some deprogramming to actually achieve said solution.

            • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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              1 year ago

              “they’d do that to us in a heartbeat” is both wrong (not every person who entertains these ideas actually wants to kill anyone) and also not even a good point. If you want to improve the world noticeably, you have to be BETTER THAN not the same as. Go talk to a nazi, actually understand what they think and feel, and figure out where that disconnect is.

            • Meowoem@sh.itjust.works
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              1 year ago

              So you’re saying for example a woman gets brought up in an environment where she’s raised as a nazi you think that it’d be acceptable for someone to rape and beat her?

              I don’t really think you do, I’m not going to bother listing other examples but you get the point - what you’re saying is not only absurd but it’s clearly not what you actually believe.

              All people are people, it’s that simple and there’s no more to it.

              • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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                1 year ago

                The first sentence you posted is exactly the thread that line of thought leads down. Disenfranchised people need to be talked to, met with empathy from the people they’ve been told are The Other. That’s the only way to destigmatize the two from each other.

  • mob@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I don’t know shit about this band/this type of music… is it actually the kind of music that only Nazis would listen to?

    Like, if someone leaked a Pantera fan list, I guess I wouldn’t be on the wagon to ruin all their lives, even though Pantera is pretty well known for racism, shouting White Power and Nazi sautes n shit.

    https://www.theguardian.com/music/2023/jan/26/pantera-shows-cancelled-after-frontmans-nazi-salute-prompts-fan-backlash

    if you didn’t know about Pantera

    • RinseDrizzle@midwest.social
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      1 year ago

      Such a fucking shame learning about great music being made by terrible folks. Sooooo many rockers with controversy, be it racism, underage groupie fucking, or otherwise.

      Thankfully there’s no shortage of really talented people making awesome music these days. May need to dig around a bit, but my Spotify is an absolute labyrinth of more tunes than I can possibly get through. I’ve had to make annual playlists for every sub genre I’m into just to attempt to keep my archive manageable.

      • damnyouclouds@sopuli.xyz
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        1 year ago

        Yep. Lot of bands you’d like to support, to buy their music, later find out they are damn bigots, nazis, whatever asswipes you can find. Especially in the metal scene. Makes me sad

    • littlecolt@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      This makes me incredibly sad.

      Edit: seriously tho. I never wanted to believe the band members were racist or anything. The song Rise was always my go to to show people how inclusive they wanted to be. “Taught when we’re young to hate one another, it’s time to have a new reign of power. Make pride universal so no one gives in, turn out backs on those who oppose”

      I always thought that song especially was saying “we must not hate one another. We must all be proud of who we are and turn our backs on those who continue to hate.” I may need to do some deeper thinking about it all. I have not listened to them in many years. Dimebag dying legit hurt.

    • penquin@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      Damn it. Why did you have to make me aware of this? :/ I love Pantera.

    • some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org
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      1 year ago

      Phil Anselmo did a nazi salute. This made me sad. But the band didn’t market themselves as nazis or write songs that praised nazism or overt racism. I wouldn’t mind if someone knew that I own all their albums (except the one where they were apparently a hair band; I never saw that in stores when I was buying CDs). They didn’t make nazi music, so I can defend it.

      I won’t send money their way because of the nazi salute. That I can also defend.

      • mob@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Oh yeah, I’m not trying to blame a fan base over the actions of a group/artist. I also don’t know what type of music the original post is about. Maybe they do make music thats like “we are Nazis and so are you if you sre listening” and then I’d probably be understanding of consequences of being fans.

        But that Nazi salute is definitely not the only documented racism by Pantera members, and I’m sure you know that.

        That doesn’t make their fans racist imo

  • Amaltheamannen@lemmy.ml
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    1 year ago

    AFA Sweden stands för Antifascistiskt Aktion, or Antifascist Action. Not Stockholm based as they claim, there are many groups.

    Great job in leaning Midgard, they also regularly doxx Swedish Nazis on their main website.