Asking this as a Qatari with a polygamous father. My father’s second wife is Swedish and I know it was a tough pill to swallow for her family and friends back home.

  • Zoldyck@lemmy.world
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    5 hours ago

    Are your dads wives allowed to have more than one husband? There’s your answer.

    • ValiantDust@feddit.org
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      5 hours ago

      To add to this: If both men and women are allowed to have multiple spouses (which is the only fair way to do it), how do you deal with situations where a husband has multiple wives who has multiple husbands who also have multiple spouses? This sounds like a nightmare from a legal perspective.

      I’m not saying I’m against polyamory, do whatever you want, as long as everybody involved is fine with it. It could work legally, if you could get married as a group of n people but then not marry other people individually. But that’s not how polygamy works in Quatar or worked for Mormons. There the husband marries several wives individually and the wives have no say in it.

      • grue@lemmy.world
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        2 hours ago

        To add to this: If both men and women are allowed to have multiple spouses (which is the only fair way to do it), how do you deal with situations where a husband has multiple wives who has multiple husbands who also have multiple spouses? This sounds like a nightmare

        That sounds Denobulan, LOL.

      • neidu3@sh.itjust.worksM
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        4 hours ago

        Imagine if the richest person in the country dies, and it’s time to figure out the inheritance for the spouses, and it turns out the entire country is in effect married in a loooong chain.

      • myheadphoneson@reddthat.comOP
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        5 hours ago

        My mom had it written in her marriage contract that her consent is required for father to take more wives. She had a decisive say in it.

        • ValiantDust@feddit.org
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          5 hours ago

          Okay, my bad. But the fact that she had to have it explicitly written in her marriage contract means that it’s not the legal standard and doesn’t apply to every other woman in Quatar. And it still only works because she doesn’t marry anyone else.

          • myheadphoneson@reddthat.comOP
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            4 hours ago

            True, Qatar’s legal system is based on Islam and Islam entitles a man to max 4 wives concurrently. It’s why you can’t explicitly write in your marriage contract that the husband is not allowed any more wives - that’s his right. You can circumvent this by stating he needs your consent instead. In Islam silence implies consent, so if you don’t specify anything about this it’s taken as “my husband is free to take more wives without consulting me”.

            • makingStuffForFun@lemmy.ml
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              3 hours ago

              And with that, it shows men are not considered equal to women.

              So, in the many countries where women are considered equal, this right of the man only, is not going to fly.

              Can she have 4 husbands? If so, I retract.

            • ValiantDust@feddit.org
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              4 hours ago

              And how could this not be frowned upon by cultures such as Swedish where women and men are regarded as equals?

              Edit: It’s not about polygamy per se but about the women’s role this kind of polygamous marriage. I don’t know your family and it might work for everyone involved but that’s where her connection’s worry comes from.

      • dingus@lemmy.world
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        1 hour ago

        So why do you feel that it’s ok for your dad to have multiple wives, but not for his wives to have multiple husbands? Curious.

        • myheadphoneson@reddthat.comOP
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          1 hour ago

          Because men and women have different roles as described in the Quran: “Men are the caretakers of women, as men have been provisioned by Allah over women and tasked with supporting them financially. And righteous women are devoutly obedient and, when alone, protective of what Allah has entrusted them with.” - Surah An-Nisa (4:34). I don’t believe this makes men and women any less equal, just different. For example men don’t have the luxury of being provided for that women have. Qatari women only work if they want to and most of the time recreationally/ out of passion, not out of need. Qatari women are provided with household staff by their husbands to make their lives easier. If we’re going to go down the route of “equal = same” then I guess this is discriminatory towards men.

          • Nibodhika@lemmy.world
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            36 minutes ago

            And there is your answer, the civilized world shouldn’t care about what any religious text has to say about this, otherwise I could point at other religious text that says the opposite or encourages Muslims to be stoned to death and claim that should be allowed because it’s in my sacred book.

            We decided as a society that we will separate the church from the state, that way there’s freedom of religion and freedom from religion, and this cus both ways, you get to practice your religion but you don’t get to force others into things because your sacred book says so, and in exchange others don’t force you into their sacred rituals.

            If you can give an argument for why this should be allowed only for one gender that’s not based on religious text or bigotry and respects the constitution (which in most civilized places says that everyone is equal towards the law) then I would love to hear it, until then the Quran is just a valid argument as the Flying Spaghetti Monster Bible.

            • myheadphoneson@reddthat.comOP
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              23 minutes ago

              Well, in our case the constitution is explicitly based on the Quran - more specifically Islamic scriptures: Quran + hadith (Part 1, Article 1: Islam is official religion of the state, and sharia a principal source of legislation.) The 2 are intertwined.

          • Maeve@kbin.earth
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            59 minutes ago

            If we’re going to go down the route of “equal = same” then I guess this is discriminatory towards men.

            In that they’re not being “provided for?”

            They’re provided sex and usually a bloodline.

            How are servants treated, as an aside?

            • myheadphoneson@reddthat.comOP
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              54 minutes ago

              In the way that they don’t get to choose if they want to stay at home and live a relatively leisurely lifestyle or work. That depends on the household.

              • Maeve@kbin.earth
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                39 minutes ago

                Thank you for your reply. It seems we were saying the same thing. I’m not inherently against polygamy, but ethical polyandry seems more fair. I’ve never been involved in either, but I’ve experienced exes with side dishes, which is a whole other can of worms. Imo, it’s sexual abuse in that it nonconsensualy exposes the main dish to potential STI, some of those deadly, and takes time and financial resources from the main to give to the side, whereas the main gets all the work and ill temper and the side gets all the benefits.

                I’ve been voluntarily celibate for almost four years. I’m neither financially better or worse, but I enjoy a lot more leisure, peace, and have developed an close, accepting relationship with myself, God/the universe/divine/higher self (or however anyone else may view it), and am more accepting of the world at large, with the understanding I can work within limited means toward changing what I can that is important to me.

          • Zak@lemmy.world
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            40 minutes ago

            Most Western societies are much less explicitly based on religious scripture, though as others have noted negative attitudes toward polygamy may be rooted in Christianity. Some Western societies, such as the USA explicitly forbid establishing an official religion, but cultural norms are still based on the dominant religion.

            Modern ideas about equality in Western societies are not based on a religion, but on how people decided they want things to work. Until about 50 years ago, women did not have legal equality in many Western countries, and a single woman was often unable to open a bank account, rent an apartment, or get certain jobs. A social movement worked very hard to change both attitudes and laws, and now the majority belief is more or less equal = same.

            Qatari women are provided with household staff by their husbands to make their lives easier.

            How does this work for people who are not extremely wealthy, such as members of your household staff?

    • softcat@lemmy.ca
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      5 hours ago

      So the answer is, “no”, but isn’t that obvious? That’s not much of an explanation really. While pithy it’s not very useful.

      As others have pointed out, some parts of the West do currently practice polygamy, or have in the past, but the reasons why it’s largely frowned upon aren’t explained in this response.