Israel and allies have spent enormous resources convincing themselves and anyone they can that Palestinians don’t exist.

Your iPhone / Samsung is manufactured there. So no, that’s a bad take. You get what you pay for, and good quality is still cheaper than made elsewhere.

That is not true unfortunately. I tend to be very left wing socially - economically I’m more left of center - and that was reflected on my social media as well - either pushing me towards more radical content or stoking anger with more radical right wing content to get me riled up and coming back for more.

I ended up with a growing hatred and emnity for a growing number of people and “groups”, and black and white thinking. Even though I was aware that I was being manipulated, it was still impossible to sit on a high horse above the fray.

It’s quite easy to manipulate human minds, even ones that are careful and aware. We can all be manipulated. It’s why advertising works, for example.

The only thing to do really is to not play that game. Avoid advertising, avoid other content curators deciding what you get to see and telling you how to reason, etc… realise that most people are empathetic, that most people want what’s best, and those that are radical have been manipulated to be that way, sadly.

This is the first generation with worse prospects than the previous one. Wealth inequality is growing, and robber barons are back. Climate change is making any prospects even worse.

Combine that with a communication revolution (social media, to be exact) which allows anyone to pretty much target anyone else with any message they feel like, means disinformation pushing narratives is everywhere. And not to forget, there people in charge of these platforms are among the aforementioned robber barons.

It’s easy to offer simple solutions to these problems and push disinformation to people who don’t have the knowledge, time or energy to debunk everything and think deeply about things, since they’re busy slaving away to put food on their tables, struggling to build a future, and looking for solutions. And simple answers give people a sense of control or explanation over their difficult situation.

It’s why I have completely removed myself from every social media platform there is, except this one and I’m only on here intermittently.

Israelis will never accept to become a minority. It’s as simple as that.

Honestly? Yeah I don’t see any way around this than to simply predicate all aid to the region on conditions.

1. Israel on the demand that not one more brick be laid anywhere outside Israel’s borders and a plan with enforcement mechanisms to dismantle the settlements that are there in order to guarantee the possibility of a sustainable Palestinian state with an economy under their own control (I.e that trade, commerce, construction, monetary policy be Palestinian and not imposed by Israel). That reparations be paid to families of the victims of this bombing campaign and settler violence over the years, that those who perpetrated violence be brought to justice.

2. Palestine on the condition that they renounce the right of return, that they apprehend and surrender all militants to an international tribunal, that they recognize Israel, that they pay reparations to the families of Israelis that have been killed over the years.

3. Egypt and Jordan on the demand that they participate in the enforcement of the above.

4. for all parties, that Jerusalem be declared either an international city, or joint capital (split East-West).

5. that Iran be completely isolated from the region. This is a tough one, they have their fingers deep within Syria, Iraq, Yemen, and Lebanon.

It’s unclear how anything else can work.

If this requires a permanent UN military mission with the right to shoot to kill any threat all along the border of both Palestine and Israel, I’m fine with it. If it means Israel bitches and moans about how unfair it is, who cares. It’s about time they respected and enforced the law. If it means Palestinians need to fight to dismantle their own militant orgs and fight for peace, at least they will have a light at the end of that tunnel instead of the despair of the past 70 years (and earlier too, tbh).

Hamas doesn’t give a fuck about peace, ceasefires, children, or anything else.

That doesn’t mean Israel should get carte blanche to do whatever they want. Let’s not forget that prominent members of the current Israeli government have expressed very clear genocidal desires of their own.

You make some strange and easily debunkable claims here.

• If “all Palestinians” cherished Hamas there wouldn’t be a Fatah or a PA.

• The Israeli right wing literally supported Hamas over Fatah in order to justify continued violence and land theft against the Palestinians. Hamas and the settlers (who are now the Israeli government) are literally feeding off each other.

• The main reason this attack succeeded was because the Gaza border was unmanned, because the current Israeli government moved the military to the West Bank in order to protect the settlers there while they commit attacks on the Palestinians there. Despite the Israeli military describing some of the actions of these settlers as a “progrom”.

• The “Muslim fundamentalists of the Levant” comprise Christians and other groups too, including Jews before this entire conflict started. There had been Jews in the Levant for millennia, despite it being under Muslim rule for 1400 years. Jews were still banned from Jerusalem under the Byzantines, until the Muslims conquered it and allowed Jews to return to the city. Jerusalem had a Jewish majority when the British took control of the place.

• I find this idea that the hatred is exclusively due to anti-Semitism to be the stupidest one Israel tries to put out there. Had Palestine been occupied by Bhuddists or atheists, you think they would not resist, or hate their occupier? Was the Viet-Cong motivated by anti-Christian values in fighting both France and the USA? How stupid are you?

Mainly because all the productive land was taken from them.

The few farms and fisheries in Gaza can’t produce enough for 2 million people. Especially since they aren’t allowed to mechanize their agriculture, and are limited in maritime range for fishing.

And forget the possibility of trade ports…

I’m not IN your house, I just surround your house, prevent you from leaving, can cut off your power, water and food at will.

There are quite a lot of Christians in Palestine.

The only response dumb tankies like you deserve is that if you say anything bad about Winnie in China, you’ll get literally disappeared, tortured, “reprogrammed” or killed.

On the other hand I can say Biden is garbage, Trudeau is a fanny and Sunak is a cockwomble. Nothing bad happens to me, see?

You are an idiot if you’re batting for imperialist authoritarians.

Lol @ “ban on Nazis”

Russia doesn’t care about Nazis.

Why should Russia strategically be required to invade exactly?

I’ve never heard a cogent argument on this point.

Whataboutism is literally a logical fallacy. We are talking about Russia, so talk about Russia.

So from having had a few exchanges with pro Russian accounts on Lemmy (which seems to be infested with a few very active ones) this is a summary of their arguments:

• “Ukraine is Nazi”
• “Well far right parties got a total of under 6% of the vote, and they elected a Jewish man president”
• “yeah but Bandera and whatabout America”

• “Ukraine killed ethnic Russians”
• “A huge percentage of their population are ethnic Russians, including in government, and they are fine, and were until the Russian invasion. And now it’s Russia that has killed, maimed and raped more ethnic Russians, including civilians, than Ukraine every did or even could. Including their own people thorough incompetence and corruption”.
• “Yeah but Bandera, and whatabout America”

• “Ukraine is fighting because they are forced to by their colonial masters, the USA and NATO, and Ukrainians will keep dying so long as they keep being armed”
• “Actually > 90% of the population wants to continue fighting for their country back, so what you’re basically saying is you think Ukrainians should be abandoned to Russian enslavement”
• “Yeah but Bandera, and whatabout America”

• “NATO and USA are colonialists and this is just more colonialism”
• “Actually both Russia and China are actual, bone fide land empires, with ethnic minorities that are forced to live like colonized people - including doing the fighting for Russia while their families back home live in misery and squalor and Putin’s Mafia collect mansions, private jets and yachts”
• “Yeah but Bandera, and whatabout America”

It really depends. If Russia gets to keep territory it conquered, keep children it kidnapped, not pay for the destruction and murder it wrought, see sanctions lifted and proceed to immediately re-arm and continue on its path of indoctrinating children into becoming fascist warriors for the next round, I wouldn’t call that peace.